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TOPIC: A suggestion for next year: |
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| Defense Matters
November 6, 2013
12:14:37 PM
Entry #: 4103072
| There seemed to be a lot more talk this playoff about teams asking their weaker players to not play during the playoffs thank in previous years. Obviously, if true, this goes against the fabric of the league and needs to be addressed. I have a feeling that this will be a very difficult problem to solve as no team will willingly acknowledge that they act in this way. There are two advantages to playing with a short bench consisting of your top players: 1) You turn the lineup over more frequently getting your best hitters to the plate more often and 2) You don’t have to sit your top defensive players as often as teams with a full lineup. For teams that play with a full lineup there is nothing that can be done to mitigate point 1) but the playing field can be levelled for the defensive advantage. I would propose that the league allows each team to use its own discretion when it comes to its defense during the playoffs. This would mean that everybody gets to hit but in an extreme case potentially only 10 players play defense. During the regular season the current (equal sits) rule would still apply. Alternatively, you could water down the playoff proposal to say that a team is allowed 6 players who don’t have to sit defensively but the remainder of the team must still rotate through with equal sits (this ensures that everyone plays at least 3 innings of defense even for a 15 man team). This rule would help reduce the advantage of teams with short benches and hopefully would encourage everyone to show up for playoffs which should be one of the main goals of the league.
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| Comradery Matter More
November 7, 2013
7:17:05 AM
Entry #: 4103285
| That is bull shit and would never happen you seem to fail to realize what our league is all about. It isn’t about winning or losing, it is about having fun with a great group of guys. A player should never be asked to sit on the bench during playoff weekend because he is a weaker player, he paid his fees and contributed during the year so he has the right to be on the field as much as any other “good” player. It is people like you that are giving this league a “black mark” or bad rep. Any team or player that is telling someone to sit out so they can win will be dealt with by the executive committee if we find out. Players that are given this kind of disrespect should bring it up with Chris Gonsalves or one of the execs. This way of thinking has to stop. This league is about comradery, the spirit of friendship and community in a group not about winning the championship that is just a bonus.
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| Labtech
November 7, 2013
12:50:43 PM
Entry #: 4103383
| The suggestion makes sense to me, it will avoid the Masey distraction we have this year.
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| Knight
November 8, 2013
6:49:51 AM
Entry #: 4103483
| Some points in the original suggestion are valid, reread and think outside the box.
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| Cashman
November 8, 2013
6:18:26 PM
Entry #: 4103621
| I gave it a second look and it has some merit. Needs a longer discussion but it like it.
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| Gwat
November 10, 2013
11:50:36 PM
Entry #: 4103977
| I would vote yes for this.
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| MBA89
November 12, 2013
12:43:56 PM
Entry #: 4104268
| I believe that every person is born with talent and Mr. Matters has loads of smarts and creativity. This works for me.
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| Ryno
November 14, 2013
9:49:57 PM
Entry #: 4104666
| Suggestion of the year
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| tswear
November 16, 2013
1:27:51 PM
Entry #: 4104899
| Sounds good to me, what is the next step to get this approved?
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| nsr 2
November 16, 2013
6:22:14 PM
Entry #: 4104928
| I do not like this idea. It is essentially just another way of marginalizing the players who are allegedly being asked to not show up.
Say you have 15 players show up and have 6 players never sit. You now have 4 positions per inning for 9 players. If you do the math that results in a player sitting two innings in a row 7 times (in a 8 inning game). At most these 9 players are going to be able to play 4 innings in a game, and as few as 2 if the game only goes 6 innings.
Is that really fair to those players? How would you feel if you were the player sitting two innings in a row, or only getting two innings in the field. I'm sure you wouldn't be very happy, I know I wouldn't be.
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| Ryno
November 18, 2013
10:45:01 AM
Entry #: 4105207
| Most fringe players are sheepish by the reality of playing in an abnormal position during a playoff game. This gives them the chance to opt out of taking the field and permits them to hit.
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| Lone Rangers
November 18, 2013
3:40:34 PM
Entry #: 4105292
| I think this league has really changed over the years. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it seems to have been founded as more of a community social league. However, it has turned into a pretty competitive league since the ringer rule.
What do people think of doing something radical like splitting the league into two divisions? Competitive and Non-competitive (or call it whatever you want). The split would level the talent field and would eliminate all the issues of sits or other stuff that happens around playoff weekend.
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| tuck00
November 19, 2013
1:48:38 PM
Entry #: 4105458
| Ask the mas team to set the lineup for every team......oh, sorry are you over 50 ?.........well you can shit on the bench.......hold the towels, clipboard and we will call you if we need water.
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| Jack Wagon
November 26, 2013
10:16:26 PM
Entry #: 4106621
| It has loads of merit, best on best action.
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| HR Leader
November 28, 2013
1:29:48 PM
Entry #: 4106765
| It is fair to all teams.
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| Woodsucks
December 23, 2013
10:55:12 PM
Entry #: 4108931
| Making a difference starts with yourself. Before you can complain about everything else being messed up, figure out what's wrong with you first.
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| Empress Ruler
December 26, 2013
12:30:09 PM
Entry #: 4109005
| This suggestion will change the landscape for 2014. Two thumps up.
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| Mara
January 2, 2014
11:03:55 PM
Entry #: 4109374
| Me like, me like....this is a great suggestion....Do it!
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| fazoolie
January 5, 2014
1:09:54 PM
Entry #: 4109537
| This would work for the Masters too.
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| Bud Wiser
January 6, 2014
10:48:47 PM
Entry #: 4109675
| Is this a done deal?
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| Rockstar81
January 8, 2014
8:50:45 AM
Entry #: 4109798
| Your assumptions are your windows on the world. Scrub of the current ice, or the light won't come in. This suggestion has virtue.
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| Guy Smiley
January 11, 2014
6:07:30 PM
Entry #: 4110292
| Let's do this.
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| Gelatin
January 13, 2014
1:44:21 PM
Entry #: 4110463
| This recommendation would work, only for the playoffs.
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| Beertenter
January 14, 2014
10:59:29 AM
Entry #: 4110545
| Guys, all I see is conflict here.
You will never get agreement as to who the "Top 10" are, especially if you are in the range of 8-12. This will become a popularity contest within teams.
This is a fun league and it has run fine for 30 years with equal play for all. If you want pure competitive, search out another league.
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| Knight
January 21, 2014
7:24:40 AM
Entry #: 4111297
| I have read this thread and have remained silent until now. It is not the ideal solution but it has more positives than negatives. Let's try it fir a year.
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| Rockstar81
January 22, 2014
3:25:56 PM
Entry #: 4111527
| DO IT.
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| LB4LB
January 27, 2014
5:34:19 PM
Entry #: 4112143
| This looks good, can we just try it 4 a year?
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| Mr. October
January 30, 2014
9:16:35 AM
Entry #: 4112399
| This is a tough one, lots of advantages.
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| Packerwacker
February 1, 2014
2:02:43 PM
Entry #: 4112678
| This would work for me and my team.
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| absoluteX
February 9, 2014
1:11:05 PM
Entry #: 4113345
| This could work ....this is simple.
Never argue with an idiot... first they bring you down to their level, and then they beat you up with experience.
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| BT
February 18, 2014
8:57:11 AM
Entry #: 4114196
| Give a try for one year.
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| Jim@Crow
February 25, 2014
8:34:32 PM
Entry #: 4114892
| This suggestion may be self-serving to good teams but it actually makes sense. No more discussion on who sits.
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| tuck00
March 7, 2014
5:12:17 AM
Entry #: 4115818
| You are what you do, not what you say you'll do. Play fair!
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| Empress Ruler
March 9, 2014
8:51:05 PM
Entry #: 4116078
| Is this suggestion truly up for review? If yes, I am good with a trial for one year.
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| S.pell
March 11, 2014
6:08:55 AM
Entry #: 4116245
| In the spirit of fairness, why would this work?
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| Seyms
March 11, 2014
9:20:46 AM
Entry #: 4116260
| A creative idea - but that is as far as it will go.
We may as well also just let sponsors pick their teams like ASHL and start having competitive divisions.
This is a league where defensive sits and 15 guys on a team all get a chance to play and strategy comes into play.
Remeber why you play in this league - all star teams are for tourney ball
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| Packerwacker
March 13, 2014
9:51:09 AM
Entry #: 4116495
| I disagree, it has some merit and is worth a try. All teams will then have 15 payers during the playoffs.
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| Nate_8
March 14, 2014
12:26:20 PM
Entry #: 4116606
| I also give this suggestion a big thumbs up.
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| Seyms
March 14, 2014
1:46:23 PM
Entry #: 4116612
| I am not suggesting it is without merit, nor am I saying it is not feasible...
My point is simply that the league is supposed to be recreational and there are a lot of people that will not sign up, pay fees and make the effort to go to the park to sit on the bench and bat 12th. If the amount of players decreases, we loose priority of diamond time not to mention everyone’s league fees would go up
It is fine for all of the "best players", but what about the " fringe" guys who may have slowed down a bit... tell them all if they aren’t in the top 10 on D, don’t bring a glove? If your team is short guys, put them as catcher for a game? I would not want to show up just to bat once in a while and not play d.
The idea has merit, I simply believe that it would be tough to implement in the league as it stands - just my two cents but happy to discuss
And my team could benefit more from this rule being in place than some other squads
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| Caryme
March 17, 2014
9:51:08 AM
Entry #: 4116853
| It has been a long winter reading things written by people who can read and spell. This has been refreshing. I wish you all luck this year. I know there are a few teachers in the league- is there anyone with some extra Phonics workbooks laying around that some of these guys could leaf through between games? This tread is worth some dialogue.
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| Hard Express
March 21, 2014
8:44:42 PM
Entry #: 4117462
| Do it , works 4 me.
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| Defense Matters
March 31, 2014
8:35:57 PM
Entry #: 4118540
| I put this suggestion out in November looking for feedback. I thank you all for your input, mostly positive. Where do we go from here? If it is not good for this year can we give it a shot in 2015?
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| AP66
April 8, 2014
7:07:57 AM
Entry #: 4119528
| Having run many teams over the yrs it is tough to manage a team.
Playing everyone sometimes is not possible while trying to improve your team or win.
It is more than a beer league. There is a lot of talent in the league and a lot of competitive teams.
My take is you play your best players and hope to find time to play your subs whenever possible because they show up every week too. It is a fine line if you want to be competitive.
It depends on whether you are playing to win or playing to play because u enjoy ball.
My tourney team is the toughest to run because every guy is a good player and deserves to play. I have to sit talented players and do the best I can to get everyone playing time.
Running a team is definitely a THANKLESS Job.
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| Gwat
April 9, 2014
3:46:52 PM
Entry #: 4119814
| Try it in 2015.
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| Barnstormer
April 9, 2014
4:35:37 PM
Entry #: 4119818
| I definitely think this idea has merit, though I see plenty of validity to Ricky's counter-argument too.
Seyms, my response to you would be that as a 'playoff only' rule it wouldn't affect the "fringe" players for 26 of the 30 games (or so) games they play all season anyway. Also, a lot of those players - and I don't want to act as if I speak for them, so I welcome debate if I'm off target here - want to win as much in the playoffs as their teammates.
They know that them playing a couple less innings on defence (and let's be honest, if it's a full squad they're already sitting 3 innings out of 7) may help accomplish that. Personally, if I knew that me sitting a grand total of 8-10 extra innings in a 5 month season would help my team win the championship I wouldn't mind making it. I'm not suggesting there isn't a guy in this league (or several) who may disagree, but I feel the benefits far outweigh the negatives.
This would negate the advantage of any manager trying to be shady and suggest certain players not come while also encouraging said 'fringe' players to show up for playoff weekend, which is when we want everyone around.
For all of those arguing about the "spirit of the league", I hear you - I may be young but I've grown up in Unionville all my life and would rather be part of this league on an 0-26 team than any other on a championship team.
That being said, this league has clearly become more competitive in recent years and change at some point becomes a necessity. I think the solution proposed here is a lot less drastic than splitting it into two divisions, and would be good to try on a one-year trial basis.
Good to see some real discussion going on in the forum this off-season - can't wait to get back on the diamond.
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| Dew
April 10, 2014
2:53:29 PM
Entry #: 4120065
| Where is the integrity?
This league is second to none. Leave it as it is and hold each other accountable to play fair.
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| Lone Rangers
April 10, 2014
7:58:59 PM
Entry #: 4120128
| I’d make everyone sits once, then the rest of the sits are the coach’s decision.
I’d also take it a step further. Make a minimum games played rule. If you don’t play that many games you don’t play the playoffs or if the team doesn’t have enough guys then it’s a team decision.
This would avoid teams hiding ringers that only play a handful of games as well as not punish teams that have chronic attendance issues.
Personally I find it irritating when you play with 8-9-10 guys all year and then you have 14 for playoff weekend. Usually these guys haven’t taken a cut or fielded a ball in weeks and cost the team. Guys that have showed up every week and carried the team have to take extra sits and miss AB’s, plus these guys are usually your weakest players either due to skill or rust. It makes it very difficult to compete with teams that don’t have these players.
The opposite is also true. When you play teams that have a guy show up to hit in the 4 hole and play center that you haven’t seen all year.
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| Defense Matters
September 7, 2015
5:24:23 PM
Entry #: 4180942
| I hope we can review my suggestion this coming off season.
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| JAG28
September 8, 2015
1:06:15 PM
Entry #: 4181023
| Ya right. Improve the defense and have the non-defensive players bat 3 times - because you've improved the defensive and shortened the number of batters during the game. Thanks for showing up and taking your 3 cuts.
Your suggestion is only a poor bandage.
3 Divisions: A Competive - B Less Competitive and Masters (A and B teams can protect 6 guys over 50 - father playing with son need not be protected)
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| Empress Ruler
September 9, 2015
2:34:15 PM
Entry #: 4181170
| To be repetitive
This suggestion will change the landscape for 2014. Two thumps up.
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| JAG28
September 10, 2015
12:41:40 PM
Entry #: 4181283
| It certainly will you will get rid of all the players deemed to be unable to play defence.
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